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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
 Posted - 02/09/2009 : 15:23:59
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| Anyone use hydrogen peroxide instead of chlorine on their well? |
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cow_rancher
USA
1110 Posts |
Posted - 02/09/2009 : 15:45:46
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Food Grade H2O2 (35%) probably won't hurt you if you flush the well enought afterward, I'm just not sure how much you would use. You could try a pint, let it sit for a while, flush it, and get the water re-tested.
Don't bother with the medicine cabinet grade peroxide.
... I assume you have a bacterial problem.
Rancher |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 02/09/2009 : 17:13:45
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| I guess I mean as a constant injection, versus using a typical liquid chlorinator pump.... Pumping into water inlet of the house, versus going into the well body itself. |
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Andy CWS-I
81 Posts |
Posted - 02/10/2009 : 16:42:20
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I use H202 instead of Cl. I find it more effective and doesn't have the disinfection by-products that chlorine has.
You cannot use a diaphram pump, though. You need to use a peristaltic pump like a Stenner, which is self priming and easy to maintain.
Are you consideringthis for iron and/or sulfur removal?
Andy Christensen, CWS-II
Going cheap can be very costly. |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 02/11/2009 : 12:28:48
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I have sulphur reducing bacteria (smell bad) - for control we're planning on using a carbon filter (centaur) with a "passive" device for adding oxygen:
http://www.aquascience.net/centaur/index.cfm?id=204
As carbon filters can be a bed for organic setup, I thought we'd use a peroxide pump to control the biologicals and perhaps add additional oxidation? I could go without and periodically back flush with a manually added chlorine mixture.
I really don't want to do full time Chlorine - I've read nothing good about experiences dealing with Chlorine mixes, pumps, or mixture control.. Plus it's hard on the carbon media.
Gary sells an in-line Chlorinator that I could consider and "mixing tank" - which I've never seen used before, but it reduces the need for a contact tank. The downside is that the pellets are expensive.
What I'm reading is that solutions of 7% hydrogen peroxide must be diluted at about 15:1 - of course that depends on how much you're injecting. Solutions of 35% would have to be diluted more - but I can get that sorted out.
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Hidropur
Honduras
799 Posts |
Posted - 02/12/2009 : 20:33:17
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1) Peroxide doesn't have a residual so you can't use it in the tropics if your problem is an infected water supply.
2) Peroxide has a short half life so it reduces to water and oxygen. No need to remove it with Carbon or other means.
3) 35% Peroxide has it's problems: It'll burn your skin on contact. It'll destroy fabrics and leather goods (your boots).
4) That passive device is most likely an eductor and they have some limitations like pressure drop and clogging.
David |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 02/19/2009 : 08:45:46
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Thanks, Dave.
1) We're not in the tropics. Wells in the area don't have a history of bacterial contamination.
2) The carbon filter was being used with an oxygen chamber tank setup to reduce any possible residual hydrogen sulfide. As carbon tends to be a "bed" for organics - I thought some sort of organic control would be necessary... Our other option would be to use a Manganese dioxide media.
3) I agree that at a 35% solution it's a powerful oxidizer. It'll obviously need to be significantly diluted. It seems to be overall less expensive than well-quality chlorine tablets, however..
4) I have yet to see any oxidizer injection device that doesn't have a history of clogging problems, perhaps with the exception of Gary's "erosion" chlorinator and mixing tank. If you know that this device has more problems than most, I'd certainly appreciate that reference...
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Hidropur
Honduras
799 Posts |
Posted - 02/21/2009 : 05:25:43
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1) Things can change on an aquifier on the drop of a dime: One really big snow, rain, tornado, huracaine, drought, etc. and your acquifier gets contaminated. Or the worst kind of dissaster for an aquifier: a DIY well driller. If you don't have a dissinfection system in place then all your family gets sick.
2)Organics are NOT the same as microbiologicals. Organics are Organic Chemicals such as petroleum distillates, benzene, pesticides, derivatives from plant resins, chlorine is an organic chemical. Microbiologicals are pathogenic and non-pathogenic living organisms such as bacteria, viruses, fungi, algae, spores, worms, and protozoa.
Yes, you should maintain your Carbon dissinfected with either chlorine, peroxide, KMnO4, bromide, ozone, etc.
3) In my neck of the woods, peroxide dissinfection would be more expensive than chlorine dissinfection.
4) You would need an electrical chemical dossing pump such as Pulsafeeder, Stenner, Blue-White, etc. I would concentrate on a peristatic type feeder.
ALL feeders (manual and electric) will have some clogging from year to year depending on the water chemistry and volume of usafe. The beauty of a feeder pump is that you only need to unhook the Chlorine draw line and hook in a new line to feed some HCl as a preventive maintenance and you're trouble free.
David |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2009 : 11:58:53
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I think our plan is going to be to have 3 "drinking water" sources - all on RO and UV. We have purchase a large GE "Merlin" system that will provide water to 2 faucets and an ice-maker.
Our water quality is as such that the only way to get good quality out of it would be "whole house" RO or a rainwater system. Right now we at a 40-year drought level and a rainwater system simply isn't practical.
I appreciate your advice. The standard approach is obviously a chlorine solution and a Stenner pump. Another approach is Gary Slusser's "erosion" chlorinator and mixing tank. Chlorine tablets are fairly epensive. |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2009 : 12:56:29
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OK, so here's what we're going to try.
Spin-down Sediment filter (30 microns)
Big Blue sediment filter (5 micron)
96k Clack WS-1 water softener with MediaGuard (K85) filtration.
The Clack WS-1 will be fitted with a high flow back-flush valve to meet the needs of the heavy K85 media.
We're using K85 to help with hydrogen sulfide and as has anti-bacterial properties.
From there we go to a Sterilight 8 gpm UV light, to scramble anything that remains.
Drinking water is then provided via a GE Merlin tankless RO unit.
Costs:
Spin-down filter, Big blue filter: ~$145
96k softener, WS-1 valve, by-pass, high back-flush valve, K85 media guard: $964
Sterilight 8gpm S8Q-PA UV light, ~$350
GE Merlin, $400 |
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Andy CWS-I
81 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2009 : 13:30:03
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Glad to hear you you've emade a choice about your water treatment. A couple of questions. How much sufur are you trying to remove? Is your MediaGuard a 4- or 6- canister unit? Were you given any expalanation on the life of the KDF and how to change it?
Can you explain the 'extra' backwashing equipment and how many gallons per minutes are you trying to accommplish?
The UV is a Class B. I recommend Class A system for bacterial/viral organism that pose a danger.
What is your water pressure range?
Hope it works out.
Andy Christensen, CWS-II
Going cheap can be very costly. |
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dginther
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 03/02/2009 : 14:44:11
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Andy,
Our hydrogen sulfide amount has not been tested. As it disappears fairly quickly, we're dealing with the "nose" test here. Basically, I can smell it in a shower, but it's not particularly noticeable otherwise.
One of my concerns with the KDF media is the weight. Manufacturer recommended backwash rates is 30 GPM per sqft of media, which is obviously huge. The mediaguard solution is a smaller amount of material ( I really don't know if this is the 4 or 6 canister unit). It's either 4 lb or 6lb of material.
I read that one of the problems with the mediaguard solution was a require back flow rate beyond the capacity of most softener valves. At least two vendors attempt to solve this by adding a higher flow "button" for back flow, which I assume is a larger back flow valve on the WS-1... We'll see if it works.
I was given the standard vendor explanation of a "10 year" life span - but I chalk that up to typical sales speak. I haven't seen many actual posts of consumer experience on lifespan. If I can get 1-3 years out of it, I'll be relatively happy. I was not told how to remove it, but I researched how it was installed and realize that it'll be a pain to change if there is media in the tank.
We'll need to retest our well for bacteria. Of the 4 wells in the area, none have a history of bacterial issues - but it would be best to test.
Water pressure settings on my pump currently engage the pump at 40 psi and turn it off at 70psi. This is before any regulator (not yet installed) at the house. I can install the unit before or after the regulator.
This may not be enough equipment - but I have hardness that justifies the size of the softener. We may need additional equipment in front of the softener (outside of the typical sediment filters) - but that can be added later if we still smell hydrogen sulfide.
Differences in Class-A and Class-B UV seem to be safety features. We're not dealing with unhealthy water here to the best of my knowledge (at this time). I can understand the recommendation. This is mainly an experiment to avoid chlorination. Our water is terribly hard and we'll need to see how long the quartz tube lasts...
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Edited by - dginther on 03/02/2009 15:19:35 |
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hydrogen peroxide instead of chlorine
